Are there fewer people applying this year?

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Re: Are there fewer people applying this year?

Postby Namisuke » Wed Dec 21, 2011 11:38 am

As for my prefecture, the measurements are taken at the government office where some of our CIRs work. They can clearly see the instrument. Even workers at the office want to know the levels, so I don't see what the conspiracy you mention is. The main government of Japan admitted to giving some false information through their media sources to calm some panic. However, if you can find a source you trust, then that is the best you can do. I think there are other sources to find detectors that are non-government based, though I haven't looked for them. You can see from the MEXT site daily reports in different prefectures. Most prefectures reported no change or no significant change in radiation levels after the main incident. The direction of the wind also helped us out a bit as it tends to move a bit south and away from Japan, at least in the season the main incident happened in. I am not sure how the wind flows now. Doing the proper research and knowing who to go to for answers is a big help. I also learned to boycott CNN as they came here, stirred up panic to get it on film, lied to people for reactions, and completely twisted people's words in interviews to create dramatic stories. For us in Tohoku, there was a group of foreign scientists who came in to evaluate the situation and state what areas were safe and which were not and us ALTs received the info via email forward. What they said turned out true, so that source was also a good one. We have a good PA system in Akita, so it is good to have one you can count on.

Hopefully this info is somewhat helpful.
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Re: Are there fewer people applying this year?

Postby KaitouK » Fri Dec 23, 2011 2:52 am

Idril wrote:I think some of you are missing the point.
Yes, we are exposed to radiation everyday from various objects, but what is worrisome is that the possible exposure to gamma radiation.
Gamma waves can only be stopped with several feet of concrete, whereas "everyday radiation" can be stopped by your skin (even β-rays from microwaves etc are generally harmless).


I wouldn't make light of alpha and beta particles just because they can be easily shielded. Should you happen to ingest something that emits the particles, you can still experience internal damage. Noted that microwaves are generally harmless, though I wouldn't suggest monkeying around on an active high powered telecommunications dish. Just imagine you "cooking" yourself, I'm sure that is bound to tick off a few cells in your body.

Also, the background radiation (or as you call it "everyday radiation") I mentioned earlier specifically relates to the exposure of ionizing radiation, which are measured in sieverts (typically measured in milli-, micro-, and nano-sieverts). This measurement is what I discussed earlier as to what governments around the world utilize to determine acceptable levels of exposure.

In most countries, the current maximum permissible dose to radiation workers is 20 mSv (millisievert) per year averaged over five years, with a maximum of 50 mSv in any one year. This is over and above background exposure, and excludes medical exposure.
(From wiki: Sievert)

Like I said, we are exposed to harmful radiation every day. The body is able to cope with small amounts of exposure over a period of time. Now this doesn't mean that the body isn't being damaged, but the body does have an incredible ability to repair the small amounts of damage done over time.

If you look at this radiation map of Japan. You can easily calculate your annual exposure to see how close you are to the limit.
Assuming you were near the upper 1,600 nSv/h on the map it would come out to (1600 * 0.000001) = (0.0016 mSv/h * 24 (hours)) * 365 days = 14.016 mSv/year which is within the 20 mSv/year allotment though I wouldn't suggest going anywhere near that limit.

Here are some annual values referenced in the Sievert wiki article for comparison:
-- Average individual background radiation dose: 2 mSv/year; 1.5 mSv/year for Australians, 3.0 mSv/year for Americans
-- New York-Tokyo flights for airline crew: 9 mSv/year

For a little perspective, a one-time exposure from a chest CT scan is 6–18 mSv.

Namisuke wrote:Too often people compare high radiation levels to eating bananas. Yes, bananas have some natural radiation, but it should in no way be used to measure radiation in Fukushima. This whole banana trend that came out this year personally drives me nuts because it confuses people who don't know much about radiation and makes light of something that can be really serious if strange comparisons are used.


You shouldn't get your knickers in a twist over something like that, it is a valid comparison as there is enough radioactivity present to allow the comparison to be drawn. It doesn't make light of anything as it is just a function for reference and conversion. Also, the banana trend as you call it, started back in 1995. Granted, people need to understand that potassium-40 is a source of non-ionizing radiation.

According to the US Environmental Protection Agency (EPA), the conversion factor (CEDE) is 5.02 nanosieverts over 50 years for each becquerel of isotopically pure potassium-40 ingested by an average adult. Using this factor, one banana equivalent dose comes out as about 5.02 nSv/Bq × 31 Bq/g × 0.5 g ≈ 78 nanosieverts = 0.078 μSv. In informal publications one often sees this estimate rounded up to 0.1 μSv. ~ Although small in environmental and medical terms, the radioactivity of a few bananas is sufficient to trigger radiation sensors used to detect possible smuggling of nuclear material at U.S. ports.
(From wiki: Banana Equivalent Dose)

Namisuke wrote:You won't need a radiation detector in Japan. Radiation levels are posted online from multiple sources. It is important to take risks seriously, but also to not get to wild and imaginative about it. Taking a radiation detector everywhere would be like wearing a hard hat all the time. That's not too realistic.


I'm not sure how you can simply declare what is realistic for people. If someone wants to wear a personal sized radiation meter (they have small pendant sized ones that sound an alarm if the dose per hour gets too high), that is their choice to have it. Irradiated debris was potentially flung from the resulting exterior explosions around the reactor with no way of knowing how far the bits of debris traveled. Should you happen to cross a piece of metal that absorbed enough radiation and stayed around it long enough, you can put yourself at risk. Again, the chances of coming across a significantly irradiated piece of debris is slim to none, but if you find yourself in an environment that has an elevated chance of it occurring, it doesn't hurt to be a bit more prepared.

TL;DR: @Idril You seemed to have labeled background radiation as merely just exposure to alpha and beta particles (which isn't true), though the majority of ionizing radiation from space is broken down by the atmosphere. It's not just gamma rays to worry about, but all manner of ionized particles. @Namisuke It is definitely important to find good sources of information, but is never a substitute if you wish to conduct your own research. I prefer not to wait for some "official" body to report on what is safe or not safe. It is always best to determine things for yourself, so long as you are confident you can learn how to reach the conclusion through the basic scientific principles. Also, be nice to banana's they are delicious and nutritious. :)

Good god, this was a long post... -_-
Last edited by KaitouK on Fri Dec 23, 2011 8:19 am, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: Are there fewer people applying this year?

Postby Cliodhna » Fri Dec 23, 2011 8:01 am

Essentially, I think that as long as you're not in the evacuation zone or eating food originating from the three affected prefectures and immediate surrounding areas (as the ground water is contaminated with cesium), you'll be fine. All food originating from those areas is now clearly marked, I believe, if not removed from shelves completely. I remember friends saying that food and produce from the affected areas were still being shipped and sold at discounted prices under the pretense that "if you wash it really, really, really good, you'll wash all the radiation off and it is 100% ok to eat!" (true story- this is what organizations were saying), but I don't believe this is still going on. So aside from things that are really not happening anymore and staying out of the evacuation zone, things should be fine.

Also, that regional radiation map is awesome, KaitouK, thanks for the link. :)
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Re: Are there fewer people applying this year?

Postby KaitouK » Fri Dec 23, 2011 8:21 am

Cliodhna wrote:Also, that regional radiation map is awesome, KaitouK, thanks for the link. :)


You are most welcome, I really like that map as well. :)
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Re: Are there fewer people applying this year?

Postby Cliodhna » Fri Dec 30, 2011 1:23 am

JaZkiEtH wrote:NO ONE should have to expose themselves to health risks in order to fulfill work requirements. It is an individual choice as to whether you would risk exposure of not, but that does not mean that I should not have applied if I am worried about radiation. A nuclear meltdown can happen anywhere in Japan? Yes it can happen! I fear for America..


That's fascinating how you turned a 'fear of radiation levels in Japan' to a 'I fear for america!' statement, as if other places in the 1st world don't also have extensive nuclear power plants...
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Re: Are there fewer people applying this year?

Postby hatefulsandwich » Fri Dec 30, 2011 5:18 am

I honestly don't understand this idea that you shouldn't have to risk your health in order to fulfill work duties. The simple act of living comes with the rather unfortunate side effect of dying one day. Here are other health risks to being a JET: You might get maimed by a car whilst riding your bike to work, you might get lung disease from people smoking around you at work, you might freeze to death in your poorly insulated apartment, you might be devoured by ruthless mukade. I'm not trying to say that it's just fine and dandy to be exposed to high levels of radiation - hell no, I would very much rather not do that myself. Nobody is forcing me to work in such an environment, however, and nobody is forcing anyone else here. This programme is elective. There is no reason for government or JET to feel obliged not to send people to Fukushima if they consider it safe - your opinions about the safety aren't exactly worth much to them. If you won't go, someone else sure as hell will. I also thought think that it's not Tohoku's bloody fault there was an earthquake. Why should that region be deprived of English instruction in areas that have been declared safe? If you don't trust that it's safe, then don't go.

As I previously mentioned, all of Japan is at risk of earthquakes and thus possible nuclear meltdown (where there are nuclear plants, of course). Indeed, I'm sure they could have taken more precautions and done better upkeep on the Fukushima plant. However, correct me if I'm wrong, but nothing is absolutely earthquake-proof. Otherwise we wouldn't have such a problem with big earthquakes, would we? There would just be a bout of uncomfortable wobbliness and everyone would just get on with their lives. This is evidently not the case. You can't exactly tell mother nature, "Tsk, tsk. We can't be having anymore of this earthquake business - we have Assistant Language Teachers who will not stand for this "health risk" poppycock!"

Imagine applying to be a journalist in a war-torn country and demanding not to be exposed to the risk of being shot - or maybe being a miner that demands not to be exposed to the risk of having a tunnel collapse on you. Seems rather silly, doesn't it? You can argue that those are risky jobs with inherent danger, sure, but the simple act of being in certain parts of the world exposes you to certain dangers. It's just the way it is.

TL;DR: Japan has certain dangers. If you don't like it, don't go.

That was tiring and I'm sick of this argument. No more ranting for me .
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Re: Are there fewer people applying this year?

Postby AVN » Fri Dec 30, 2011 6:22 am

hatefulsandwich wrote:I honestly don't understand this idea that you shouldn't have to risk your health in order to fulfill work duties. The simple act of living comes with the rather unfortunate side effect of dying one day. Here are other health risks to being a JET: You might get maimed by a car whilst riding your bike to work, you might get lung disease from people smoking around you at work, you might freeze to death in your poorly insulated apartment, you might be devoured by ruthless mukade. I'm not trying to say that it's just fine and dandy to be exposed to high levels of radiation - hell no, I would very much rather not do that myself. Nobody is forcing me to work in such an environment, however, and nobody is forcing anyone else here. This programme is elective. There is no reason for government or JET to feel obliged not to send people to Fukushima if they consider it safe - your opinions about the safety aren't exactly worth much to them. If you won't go, someone else sure as hell will. I also thought think that it's not Tohoku's bloody fault there was an earthquake. Why should that region be deprived of English instruction in areas that have been declared safe? If you don't trust that it's safe, then don't go.

As I previously mentioned, all of Japan is at risk of earthquakes and thus possible nuclear meltdown (where there are nuclear plants, of course). Indeed, I'm sure they could have taken more precautions and done better upkeep on the Fukushima plant. However, correct me if I'm wrong, but nothing is absolutely earthquake-proof. Otherwise we wouldn't have such a problem with big earthquakes, would we? There would just be a bout of uncomfortable wobbliness and everyone would just get on with their lives. This is evidently not the case. You can't exactly tell mother nature, "Tsk, tsk. We can't be having anymore of this earthquake business - we have Assistant Language Teachers who will not stand for this "health risk" poppycock!"

Imagine applying to be a journalist in a war-torn country and demanding not to be exposed to the risk of being shot - or maybe being a miner that demands not to be exposed to the risk of having a tunnel collapse on you. Seems rather silly, doesn't it? You can argue that those are risky jobs with inherent danger, sure, but the simple act of being in certain parts of the world exposes you to certain dangers. It's just the way it is.

TL;DR: Japan has certain dangers. If you don't like it, don't go.

That was tiring and I'm sick of this argument. No more ranting for me .


This, very much.

Japan has always had quakes. Japan has always had tsunami. Japan has always (since their invention) had nuclear power plants.
These have been and always will be (though the power plants have been a little less popular since the quake) risks in Japan.
Nothing has really changed.
You will not be placed in the evacuation zone. I know some people who were placed in Fukushima since the quake who love it more than their original placement.

We shouldn't make light of radiation but we also shouldn't panic unnecessarily.
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Re: Are there fewer people applying this year?

Postby ume no hana » Fri Dec 30, 2011 8:28 am

great input! thank you.

I know my friends and relatives are worried about the radiation and people getting placed near Fukushima....
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Re: Are there fewer people applying this year?

Postby Idril » Fri Dec 30, 2011 5:41 pm

KaitouK wrote:Idril You seemed to have labeled background radiation as merely just exposure to alpha and beta particles (which isn't true), though the majority of ionizing radiation from space is broken down by the atmosphere. It's not just gamma rays to worry about, but all manner of ionized particles.


I am aware of this, but I opted for the simple explanation because some users seem to have an only vague idea of what radiation really is :D No point mentioning radiation from space if people on here are equating banana consumption to gamma ray exposure.

KaitouK wrote:I wouldn't make light of alpha and beta particles just because they can be easily shielded. Should you happen to ingest something that emits the particles, you can still experience internal damage. Noted that microwaves are generally harmless, though I wouldn't suggest monkeying around on an active high powered telecommunications dish. Just imagine you "cooking" yourself, I'm sure that is bound to tick off a few cells in your body.


Again, opting for the simple explanation. I have never even heard of a case of alpha isotope ingestion, so I didn't consider it mentionable. And I have made the assumption that pretty much everyone knows about microwave/x-ray etc safety. I don't expect everyone to know the mechanics of it, just that it's not good for your health to get multiple x-rays, don't stand next to the microwave etc.

Cliodhna wrote:
JaZkiEtH wrote:NO ONE should have to expose themselves to health risks in order to fulfill work requirements. It is an individual choice as to whether you would risk exposure of not, but that does not mean that I should not have applied if I am worried about radiation. A nuclear meltdown can happen anywhere in Japan? Yes it can happen! I fear for America..


That's fascinating how you turned a 'fear of radiation levels in Japan' to a 'I fear for america!' statement, as if other places in the 1st world don't also have extensive nuclear power plants...


This was selectively copied from one of my previous posts. So, it seems that at least 2 people have missed the complete sarcasm of that sentence.
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Re: Are there fewer people applying this year?

Postby Cliodhna » Sat Dec 31, 2011 3:51 am

Idril wrote:
Cliodhna wrote:
JaZkiEtH wrote:NO ONE should have to expose themselves to health risks in order to fulfill work requirements. It is an individual choice as to whether you would risk exposure of not, but that does not mean that I should not have applied if I am worried about radiation. A nuclear meltdown can happen anywhere in Japan? Yes it can happen! I fear for America..


That's fascinating how you turned a 'fear of radiation levels in Japan' to a 'I fear for america!' statement, as if other places in the 1st world don't also have extensive nuclear power plants...


This was selectively copied from one of my previous posts. So, it seems that at least 2 people have missed the complete sarcasm of that sentence.


Spammers are definitely getting more savvy. :lol:
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Re: Are there fewer people applying this year?

Postby GusVIII » Sat Jan 28, 2012 9:13 am

So, anyone have any idea how many people did end up applying this year? Also, when is the interview list going to be released?
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Re: Are there fewer people applying this year?

Postby Teishou » Sat Jan 28, 2012 9:21 am

No one knows yet.
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