Leaving Early Consequences

[AVN]

You enjoyed travelling excessively, to the point of using all your vacation time.

Would you say using up all your nenkyu is excessive? I know many Japanese people avoid using it, but as I only get 12 days a year most of it is gone with just one yearly trip home.

I would say it's not as long as once you've used them up you don't expect anymore. For example breaking contract to do more traveling.

[histgirl]

You enjoyed travelling excessively, to the point of using all your vacation time.

Would you say using up all your nenkyu is excessive? I know many Japanese people avoid using it, but as I only get 12 days a year most of it is gone with just one yearly trip home.

And don't even think about asking for unpaid leave....

viewtopic.php?f=10&t=10640

[Siyris]

I think this sort of thing is what makes me twitch around some of the other ALTs I've met. Certainly not all JETs are like this... but I find a disconcerting number view JET as a fun interlude simply because there is a cap on how long any one person can work in Japan through the program.

Yes, the majority of JETs are young with their lives in transition ... however I feel (a lot of the time) like I'm in the minority in that I view it as a professional position in which I can build experience both in life and on a resume... and the fact that it's a fun job, and in a different place are certainly benefits... but past that... it boils down to being a job.
I sometimes play tug of war over vacation vs sick leave and things like that with my CO but that's because I think contracts should go both ways.... while I understand the desire to have a break before you start grad school, I don't think breaking contract so you can have said break is a good idea, especially not when it adds extra costs to you -- grad schools are expensive... if it were me, I would rather save my $1000 and stick around for another 3 weeks to let my CO pay for my ticket instead of breaking contract, breaking trust, and going on an adventure.

[Antonath]

While I understand the desire to have a break before you start grad school, I don't think breaking contract so you can have said break is a good idea, especially not when it adds extra costs to you -- grad schools are expensive... if it were me, I would rather save my $1000 and stick around for another 3 weeks to let my CO pay for my ticket instead of breaking contract, breaking trust, and going on an adventure.

Especially as three weeks' pay, plus the extra six months' pension refund, will be much more than $1000, thus letting you go on an even better trip later.

[Gizmotech]

You enjoyed travelling excessively, to the point of using all your vacation time.

Would you say using up all your nenkyu is excessive? I know many Japanese people avoid using it, but as I only get 12 days a year most of it is gone with just one yearly trip home.

Not really. Yes you can aggravate your Japanese peers by taking all your vacation, but you have the right to do so (as do they). If you can do it responsibly that is, without interfering with the classroom environment. What I was saying was the total sum of events that were discussed will leave a negative impression as all the nenkyu was burned, THEN the person f'd off to some trip breaking contract, without being responsible enough to have saved days for this event.

[histgirl]

Yes. The opportunity costs are significant. Hence the whole point of my OP.

While I understand the desire to have a break before you start grad school, I don't think breaking contract so you can have said break is a good idea, especially not when it adds extra costs to you -- grad schools are expensive... if it were me, I would rather save my $1000 and stick around for another 3 weeks to let my CO pay for my ticket instead of breaking contract, breaking trust, and going on an adventure.

Especially as three weeks' pay, plus the extra six months' pension refund, will be much more than $1000, thus letting you go on an even better trip later.

As best I can tell...
Lost income - $3000
6-months Pension - $1800
Flight - $800
Shipping Costs (for stuff I would normally have just flown home with - $300

So about $6000

However to say that you can just do something later is not true for everyone. ESID, anyone?

TIME is a finite resource. Not Money. I can always make more money, and considering the compound effect on life-long earnings, the actions I take during grad school and the years immediately after, will have a hell of a greater effect than three weeks next July. $6k might be enough to get you to not to something you wanted to do, but after giving up YEARS when I could do something like this, $6k now doesn't come close to outweighing the benefits.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=85sIJcC8zbs

And yes, getting a fat scholarship with my grad school acceptance did make me take a second look at my savings and influence my decision.

Right now, just trying to figure out how to break the news to the supervisor, and whether to spend 3-sen or 3-mon in "I'm sorry" omiyagi.

[Gizmotech]

Yes. The opportunity costs are significant. Hence the whole point of my OP.

As best I can tell...
Lost income - $3000
6-months Pension - $1800
Flight - $800
Shipping Costs (for stuff I would normally have just flown home with - $300

So about $6000

However to say that you can just do something later is not true for everyone. ESID, anyone?

The only way you can refute that statement is if you knew you would die tomorrow. Otherwise yes, there is always time, you just have to make it. This is the personal responsibility element I was trying to introduce in my replies.

TIME is a finite resource. Not Money. I can always make more money, and considering the compound effect on life-long earnings, the actions I take during grad school and the years immediately after, will have a hell of a greater effect than three weeks next July. $6k might be enough to get you to not to something you wanted to do, but after giving up YEARS when I could do something like this, $6k now doesn't come close to outweighing the benefits.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=85sIJcC8zbs

And yes, getting a fat scholarship with my grad school acceptance did make me take a second look at my savings and influence my decision.

Right now, just trying to figure out how to break the news to the supervisor, and whether to spend 3-sen or 3-mon in "I'm sorry" omiyagi.

6K is a rather large sum to dismiss for a backpacking trip, especially when there are other consequences attached. It's also more than 6k when you factor in the cost of the trip as well ontop of the potential losses. I'd imagine the total loss comes in closer to 8k doesn't it?

Also remember that Money is a finite resource because it is directly connected to time (something the modern generation seems to forget). You will likely stop earning money at a certain point in your life, unless you are very resourceful. And believe me, I understand the idea of giving up years of your life to do things and their consequences.

[AVN]

The only way you can refute that statement is if you knew you would die tomorrow. Otherwise yes, there is always time, you just have to make it. This is the personal responsibility element I was trying to introduce in my replies.

6K is a rather large sum to dismiss for a backpacking trip, especially when there are other consequences attached. It's also more than 6k when you factor in the cost of the trip as well ontop of the potential losses. I'd imagine the total loss comes in closer to 8k doesn't it?

Also remember that Money is a finite resource because it is directly connected to time (something the modern generation seems to forget). You will likely stop earning money at a certain point in your life, unless you are very resourceful. And believe me, I understand the idea of giving up years of your life to do things and their consequences.

Also as you and other mentioned earlier, she shouldn't forget the costs for other people, mostly non-monetary. It's not only her life she's affecting.

[histgirl]

The only way you can refute that statement is if you knew you would die tomorrow. Otherwise yes, there is always time, you just have to make it. This is the personal responsibility element I was trying to introduce in my replies.

I suppose, but the "once-in-a-lifetime" part of the OP is from the idea this is the only time I would allow myself to do something indulgent such as this. The personal responsibility element is never far from my mind, but note the many mentions of school, work, marriage, and babies in my previous posts. Sure, when I'm older I can "make time," but due to health/family and other concerns, time later is different than time now, and I don't reasonably see any more "time" opportunities in my 20s.

6K is a rather large sum to dismiss for a backpacking trip, especially when there are other consequences attached. It's also more than 6k when you factor in the cost of the trip as well ontop of the potential losses. I'd imagine the total loss comes in closer to 8k doesn't it?

Certainly more, and by potential losses I assume you mean the cost of the trip? (what other loses are you referring to?) Opportunity cost alone is $6k, not accounting for money you would spend anyway on living/rent/food/etc....

Maybe a Better estimate....

Trip $2500 (or so)
Forfitted Moneys $6000
Living Expenses I would be spending anyway $2000

$2500 + $6000 - $2000 = $6500

Regardless, the time is still worth more to me right now.

Also remember that Money is a finite resource because it is directly connected to time (something the modern generation seems to forget). You will likely stop earning money at a certain point in your life, unless you are very resourceful. And believe me, I understand the idea of giving up years of your life to do things and their consequences.

You're right, in the short term and on the micro level it is finite. And certainly it is tied to time. But whereas we all have the same amount of time, people use their time differently to make vastly different amounts of money. Personally this factored into decisions such as focus in school and target industry, as well as to be only a 1-year JET. It was the "letting you go on an even better trip later" statement of another poster I had a problem with. A few thousand dollars right now is worth (in your individual mind as you value it, not just spending power) is not the same as a few thousand dollars in the future. As you increase earning power, the value of money starts to become relative, and the value of your time costs much more.

In these modern times, rarely does youth and financial health intersect, so to get that precious time, I accept the consequences, because nothing comes without some cost.


And @AVNicholas - I get it. I failed your morality test.

[Gizmotech]

The only way you can refute that statement is if you knew you would die tomorrow. Otherwise yes, there is always time, you just have to make it. This is the personal responsibility element I was trying to introduce in my replies.

I suppose, but the "once-in-a-lifetime" part of the OP is from the idea this is the only time I would allow myself to do something indulgent such as this. The personal responsibility element is never far from my mind, but note the many mentions of school, work, marriage, and babies in my previous posts. Sure, when I'm older I can "make time," but due to health/family and other concerns, time later is different than time now, and I don't reasonably see any more "time" opportunities in my 20s.

That's the problem then it's a choice, not once in a life time. Standing on the precipice of a volcano as it explodes is once in a life time. Watching the fall of the Berlin wall was a once in a life time event. Backpacking through communist countries is not a once in a life time event. If you can plan so far ahead right now to plan out school, work, marriage, babies then you must have the basic capability to plan in this type of trip in the near future with far lower costs and in a more responsible manner.

6K is a rather large sum to dismiss for a backpacking trip, especially when there are other consequences attached. It's also more than 6k when you factor in the cost of the trip as well ontop of the potential losses. I'd imagine the total loss comes in closer to 8k doesn't it?

Certainly more, and by potential losses I assume you mean the cost of the trip? (what other loses are you referring to?) Opportunity cost alone is $6k, not accounting for money you would spend anyway on living/rent/food/etc....

Maybe a Better estimate....

Trip $2500 (or so)
Forfitted Moneys $6000
Living Expenses I would be spending anyway $2000

$2500 + $6000 - $2000 = $6500

Regardless, the time is still worth more to me right now.

Also remember that Money is a finite resource because it is directly connected to time (something the modern generation seems to forget). You will likely stop earning money at a certain point in your life, unless you are very resourceful. And believe me, I understand the idea of giving up years of your life to do things and their consequences.

You're right, in the short term and on the micro level it is finite. And certainly it is tied to time. But whereas we all have the same amount of time, people use their time differently to make vastly different amounts of money. Personally this factored into decisions such as focus in school and target industry, as well as to be only a 1-year JET. It was the "letting you go on an even better trip later" statement of another poster I had a problem with. A few thousand dollars right now is worth (in your individual mind as you value it, not just spending power) is not the same as a few thousand dollars in the future. As you increase earning power, the value of money starts to become relative, and the value of your time costs much more.

In these modern times, rarely does youth and financial health intersect, so to get that precious time, I accept the consequences, because nothing comes without some cost.

No, I meant in the long term money is quite finite. Regardless, you've also failed my morality test as well. The long terms costs, beyond the money, are not worth it. 3 weeks to finish a contract (a commitment) isn't a big stretch. If your grad school started 3 weeks into your contract then you'd have a good reason to ask the question (do I bail to go to those first useless weeks or not) but you're asking for a morality judgement and to assist in determining costs on an action that many have indicated is a bad choice.

Being a 1-year jet is not rationale enough. Dismissing the cash because you believe you will earn more money in the future is not enough. If you will have the earning power to recoup the cost in the future, you will also have the ability to take the time off and spend the money from this increased income on a similar vacation at an appropriate time. Your 20's are not the be all end all of your life (though I understand that many 20 year old people seem to believe this with a passion that I never understood)

[Antonath]

TIME is a finite resource. Not Money. I can always make more money...

First off, this attitude is one of the reasons the world economy is currently in the toilet

Second, I think it's pretty clear you've decided to go ahead and break your contract no matter what anyone (or, indeed, everyone) here is saying, so I'm not going to try and persuade you otherwise anymore.

Third, and this one is for the "old-timers", not the OP: has anyone noticed that the newbies seem to be getting more and more selfish / "entitled" recently?

[AVN]

Third, and this one is for the "old-timers", not the OP: has anyone noticed that the newbies seem to be getting more and more selfish / "entitled" recently?

Think everyone knows where I stand in response to your last question

[Siyris]

Third, and this one is for the "old-timers", not the OP: has anyone noticed that the newbies seem to be getting more and more selfish / "entitled" recently?

Please don't group all of the 'newbies' together. There are at least some of us who are equally disgusted with the entitled, selfish, and spoiled attitudes of most 20-somethings out there.

As you increase earning power, the value of money starts to become relative, and the value of your time costs much more.

This is a HUGE flaw in your argument. Currently, with the exchange rate where it is, a JET salary when converted to US dollars is $44K a year. That is better than the $40,584 a year average for the US as a whole right now (statistic from USA today, based off of 2010 Census data). So going into things with an assumption that you will increase your earning power over time is, as far as I can tell, naive.

But as Antonath said.... You've already decided to do this, despite the number of people that have shared opinions that it is a bad idea. I hope that, in the future, a contract will mean more to you than it seems to at the moment.

[AVN]

Third, and this one is for the "old-timers", not the OP: has anyone noticed that the newbies seem to be getting more and more selfish / "entitled" recently?

Please don't group all of the 'newbies' together. There are at least some of us who are equally disgusted with the entitled, selfish, and spoiled attitudes of most 20-somethings out there.

This is true and not all of them are like this.
I have noticed a trend though... perhaps it's my age and I'm getting to my uphill both ways time

[NiigataPAKatrina]

Third, and this one is for the "old-timers", not the OP: has anyone noticed that the newbies seem to be getting more and more selfish / "entitled" recently?

Please don't group all of the 'newbies' together. There are at least some of us who are equally disgusted with the entitled, selfish, and spoiled attitudes of most 20-somethings out there.

This is true and not all of them are like this.
I have noticed a trend though... perhaps it's my age and I'm getting to my uphill both ways time

I think it has more to do with maturity than age or years of working experience. I've seen a few people come on JET with a few years working experience who felt more entitled than some who came straight out of college.